[Anonymous]

For you, there might be an alternative solution. I’ve been thinking about using a spare 3500 square foot space above a jacuzzi in my bedroom. In order to use an NL/ML Converter with an ML Power Box for my project, there must be no ML Audio or Video Master present. Instead, you must link the ML Power Box to the NL/ML Converter. This would give you access to the NL/ML Converter’s AUX input as well as any other sources, like Deezer, TuneIn, etc., that come with any NL products, such the modestly priced Beoplay M3. You would then have a lot of flexibility in the source buttons you could map the sources to. I now have a second NL/ML Converter.

[Guy]

Lesteraction wrote:

For you, there might be an alternative solution. I’ve been thinking about using a spare 3500 square foot space above a jacuzzi in my bedroom. In order to use an NL/ML Converter with an ML Power Box for my project, there must be no ML Audio or Video Master present. Instead, you must link the ML Power Box to the NL/ML Converter. This would give you access to the NL/ML Converter’s AUX input as well as any other sources, like Deezer, TuneIn, etc., that come with any NL products, such the modestly priced Beoplay M3. You would then have a lot of flexibility in the source buttons you could map the sources to. I now have a second NL/ML Converter.

Thanks for this – yes I saw the ML Power Box mentioned by MM in this thread: https://beoworld.dev.idslogic.net/forums/topic/master-link-audio-master/#post-15890

However, I don’t have any NL equipment (yet) and am therefore looking for novel (cheap) ways to make use of much of the older B&O eqpt that I do own. The thread was started by Matador to experiment with the use of a BeoLab 3500 as a stand-alone speaker in conjunction with a BeoLink 1611 converter. This was successful and you can select two different aux sources using a B&O remote, three if you add a Beolink Active. You can get everything required (BL3500, BL1611, Active, remote and leads) for much less than the price of a second hand NL/ML converter!

The more recent experiments have looked at adding an MCL2AV to the mix so that we can add datalink control of BeoCords, Beograms etc. As far as I am aware the NL/ML converter’s aux input doesn’t allow for datalink, hence some of the things we are looking at should enable a system with datalink > ML > NL/ML converter > NL.

[Madskp]

Guy wrote:

If you use the TV to select the MCL2AV’s TAPE input using SHIFT MENU 6, and then press MENU to turn on the TV screen, does it show that the TV is receiving an A.AUX source or A.TAPE source?

Had a little time for testing this today. tried it with different setups and commands:

BC6 opt. 2 +1611 + iphone

Activating with audio command (Radio/CD/A.tape). No text on tv about source. Menu can be selected, but source is not in the headline of the menu as it is for the video sources.

BC6 opt. 2 +1611 + MCL2AV opt. 2.5 + iphone

Activating with Shift + Radio + 6 command. No text on tv about source. Menu can be selected, but source is not in the headline of the menu as it is for the video sources.

BC6 opt. 2 +1611 + MCL2AV opt 2.5 + BC3500.

Activating with A.tape command. No text on tv about source. Menu can be selected, but source is not in the headline of the menu as it is for the video sources.

So at least for my setup the TV won’t show the audio source. Don’t know if it’s different with a proper audiomaster connencted.

Guy wrote:

BL3500 in L.OPT 1, 2, 5 or 6/MCL2AV in L.OPT 0 BL3500 plays TAPE input sound whatever audio source is selected on remote – there is no separate selection/control of TAPE or CD inputs.

BC6 opt. 2 +1611 + MCL2AV opt 0 + BC3500.

No control of BC3500, and music started manually on the BC3500’s button music is playing regardless which audio command I use to activate the BC6 (A.tape/cd/radio/shift+Radio 6 or 7), so sounds like some of the same behaviour you are experiencing.

Looking at the MCL2 handbook, option 0 is mentioned for the MCL2AV, but no use case is mentioned. Our experiments seems to show that it just opens the audio ports and passes sound through in this option setting.

[Madskp]

Guy wrote:

BL3500 in L.OPT 1, 2, 5 or 6/MCL2AV in L.OPT 2.5 or 2.6 I can select and play SHIFT RADIO 6 from the BL3500 room (this doesn’t start the PL speakers connected to the MCL2AV).

If you had and Audio master instead of the MCL2AV I guess you would have the same behaviour when you start the music from a link room.

Guy wrote:

However, after selecting/controlling the BL3500 I cannot then select or control anything within the MCL2AV room. Even Mute or Volume don’t work, even though the IR receive LED is flashing on the MCL2AV’s IR sensor. Also the IR sensor MUTE button has no response. The MCL2AV room will only work again if I turn the system off and re-set the MCL2AV option settings.

However this doesn’t sound like something that would happen with an audiomaster.

Guy wrote:

BL3500 in L.OPT 1, 2, 5 or 6/MCL2AV in L.OPT 1.5 or 1.6 Independent control in both rooms is possible (has to be same MCL2AV source in each room). Can switch on (or mute) independently from either room, and ‘join’ by pressing just vol or mute in MCL2AV room (but you have to press the full SHIFT RADIO 6 to ‘join’ in the BL3500 room). The MCL2AV IR sensor’s MUTE switch works to join or mute once sound is already playing in the BL3500 room. A good useable outcome!

This sound like a great use case, especially if you have a datalink compatible unit, and also want other sources connected. The Beolab 3500 should still be able to access the Video source in the 1611 I guess?

Guy wrote:

If the MCL2AV/BL1611 combination is in the same room as another ML device (with a built-in IR sensor), disconnecting the IR sensor from the MCL2AV simplifies control. Unfortunately, you cannot then activate any PL speakers connected to the MCL2AV.

If used with a Beolab 3500 or a TV with speakers (internal or external) I dont see much use for the PL port in the same room, so this might be ok.

Guy wrote:

I will be interested to see if similar results are obtained with a BeoVision instead of the BL3500.

I will for sure be looking in to this and report back

Guy wrote:
Anyway, enough for today – apparently the ML cable across the landing is a ‘trip hazard’ and the BeoLab 3500 needs moving from our bed!

Hehe, yes it’s not always easy to make these experiments when you have other people in the house. My setup is in an attic room where I can just let it be when I’m finished without worrying about anyone tripping. only downside is that the access is through the room where our little boy is sleeping which makes experimenting in the evening hours not an option.

[Guy]

Madskp wrote:

I had some thoughts about this input selection, and it ocured to me that when the MCL2AV is used in a MCL system it will allways have an audio master with the CD and A.Tape sources available (even if nothing is connected to those connections on the Audiomaster). Therfore the MCL2AV has to register if a Datalink device is available locally, and if not it should use the Audiomaster’s source instead. This might explain the Behaviour we are seeing.

Yes that all makes sense. And with a local TAPE or CD, in a normal MCL setup you would then use the LINK button to select the TAPE or CD in the central room.

Madskp wrote:

But weird that the OneRemote radio wont work the proper way here when it is working in other situations.

Yes that’s strange – I can’t think of a sensible reason for this, but |I suppose the OneRemote devices were never tested with the older MCL2AV system, so perhaps there is just a SW anomaly.

Whilst thinking about the OneRemote, I did revisit the MCL2AV circuit diagram: I think we have noted before that the diagram is incorrect: it shows TAPE and CD datalink wired to pin 6, when it must actually be to pin 7. For the AUX input, the AAL is correctly shown to pin 6.

Madskp wrote:

It would seems as the 2 IR sensors introduce some kind of confussion in the system. But then again this was probably inteded to be used with either the IR sensor or the TV’s IR eye. I will see if I can get on with my testing tomorrow. Let me know if there are situations you like to have tested with the Beocord 3500 on datalink

You may have finished testing now so I could be too late!

• I’d be interested to hear how your setup behaves with the IR sensor removed from the MCL2AV. Or in two-rooms if you have a long enough ML cable!
• If you use the TV to select the MCL2AV’s TAPE input using SHIFT MENU 6, and then press MENU to turn on the TV screen, does it show that the TV is receiving an A.AUX source or A.TAPE source?

[Guy]

Madskp wrote:

This sound like a great use case, especially if you have a datalink compatible unit, and also want other sources connected. The Beolab 3500 should still be able to access the Video source in the 1611 I guess?

I hadn’t thought to test this earlier, so thanks for the suggestion!

I just connected the previous BL3500/BL1611/MCL2AV (no IR sensor) setup but included a Y-adaptor from the BL1611’s AAL socket. I then connected an iPad to the extra DIN socket.

So in answer, yes, you can still select a VIDEO source when the MCL2AV is also connected – any VIDEO selection (TV, SAT, DVD etc) will open this input as before. SHIFT RADIO 6 or 7 still work as before for the MCL2AV’s TAPE or CD socket.*

So the addition of the MCL2AV allows you to have a total of three selectable inputs from the BL3500.

* EDIT: One anomaly: when playing the ‘video’ source, pressing SHIFT RADIO 6 or 7 turns the BL3500 off, so to switch sources from video to audio you have to turn the system off first. There are no such problems when changing from audio to video.

[matador]

Hi there,

I suggest we rename the topics since it is now far from BL3500 and 1611 only.
It would help people to find information about all your experiments.

Being not good at naming threads, you can suggest anything that would be relevant.

Guy, fell free to rename it if I’m not around.

Regards.

[Madskp]

Guy wrote:

So the addition of the MCL2AV allows you to have a total of three selectable inputs from the BL3500.

Plus the one from the PL socket on the BL3500 MK2 with the special key combination. Don’t remember if we ever established if this input also will work in some form with the MK1 version with the MCL socket?

[Madskp]

matador wrote:

Hi there, I suggest we rename the topics since it is now far from BL3500 and 1611 only. It would help people to find information about all your experiments. Being not good at naming threads, you can suggest anything that would be relevant. Guy, fell free to rename it if I’m not around. Regards.

Yeah we got arround a lot of setups in this thread. Maybe something like “B&O black boxes unofficial use cases” 🙂

But yes this thread is lenghty and it can be hard for newcommers to fin the info. Maybe we can edit some of the important posts with relevant info tags

Another thought with the current situation for Beoworld, and idea could be to make some one or two pagers with a simple info drawing and a short description of the usecases we found in the thread that could be made available to Gold members as and added bonus? This could be true for other threads also. just a thought

[Madskp]

Guy wrote:

Yes this would be useful. Matador produced an excellent diagram that summarised the early breakthrough with the ‘dual input’ BL1611 to BeoLab 3500. When we have finished playing with the ‘added MCL2AV’ we probably need something similar to summarise the one-room/two-room configurations with TV or BL3500 connected. Perhaps when the Beoworld User/Service Manuals library has been re-vamped we could ask for a ‘Novel Configurations’ folder where we store such information?

Yes it was actually something like that I thought, placing them in the new manual library might also have the benefit the Keith doesn’t have to make a whole new “module” for it. Looking at Matadors diagram again, most things are mentioned so it’s a great format. Maybe just adding a few disclamers about what might not work for the different use cases, and for what MK and SW version the setup has been tested, and maybe a link to the thread were the info originates from.

I for one would be willing to put in some hours to make some of these configuration pages.

[Madskp]

Guy wrote:

When playing from the MCL2AV sources (TAPE and CD) the TV menu showed only A.AUX (with either MCL2AV type).

Ok interesting when it doesn’t show up on my BC6, but of course the BV10 is newer. But My BC6 also has some weird things going on once in a while, so i might just reset it to factory defaults to be sure that Im getting “clean” results from my testing.

Guy wrote:

I could also control and listen to the TV from the MCL2AV/BL1611 ‘link room’ by pressing AV TV, but couldn’t listen to any of the TV’s hdmi inputs (eg by pressing AV SAT). After trying to do so, I had to switch the system off and on again to control/hear normal TV.

If I remember correctly HDMI sources (or digital sources) can not be distributed via Masterlink, so that may be the reason for that behaviour). My BC6 doesn’t have HDMI, so I might not be able to make a comparing test.

[Guy]

Madskp wrote:

If I remember correctly HDMI sources (or digital sources) can not be distributed via Masterlink, so that may be the reason for that behaviour).

Yes I think that’s the problem. I did once temporarily setup a BV6 as a link TV from my BV10-32 and was able to distribute hdmi sources (eg Apple TV) with sound and picture on the BV6. I didn’t investigate much but I suspect that it was mono sound coming over the Co-Ax rather than ML. The picture was pretty poor too!

[Guy]

matador wrote:

I suggest we rename the topics since it is now far from BL3500 and 1611 only. It would help people to find information about all your experiments. Being not good at naming threads, you can suggest anything that would be relevant.

I agree! The common piece of equipment used in every trial setup is the BeoLink Converter 1611, so how about a new thread title of ‘BeoLink Converter 1611 Innovative Configurations’?

Madskp wrote:

But yes this thread is lenghty and it can be hard for newcommers to fin the info. Maybe we can edit some of the important posts with relevant info tags

I just went back to the first post where I mentioned MCL2AV and added a tag of ‘MCL2AV’. However, this seems to have added that tag to each of my posts (edit – everyone’s posts!) throughout the thread, which I am not sure is right (or useful). I will have a chat to Keith about the use of tags and how it may improve the search function. On that note, when doing a Google search for B&O information I think I am seeing less ‘Beoworld’ hits than before. Perhaps this is related to the new forum?

Madskp wrote:

Another thought with the current situation for Beoworld, and idea could be to make some one or two pagers with a simple info drawing and a short description of the usecases we found in the thread that could be made available to Gold members as and added bonus? This could be true for other threads also. just a thought

Yes this would be useful. Matador produced an excellent diagram that summarised the early breakthrough with the ‘dual input’ BL1611 to BeoLab 3500. When we have finished playing with the ‘added MCL2AV’ we probably need something similar to summarise the one-room/two-room configurations with TV or BL3500 connected. Perhaps when the Beoworld User/Service Manuals library has been re-vamped we could ask for a ‘Novel Configurations’ folder where we store such information?

[Guy]

But back to the experiments …

Yesterday I had a quick look at the MCL2AV (L.OPT1.5)/BL1611 connected by ML to my BV10-32 (V.OPT 2) in a separate room. Overall, as a controlling device, the TV behaved pretty much like the BL3500. When playing from the MCL2AV sources (TAPE and CD) the TV menu showed only A.AUX (with either MCL2AV type).

I could also control and listen to the TV from the MCL2AV/BL1611 ‘link room’ by pressing AV TV, but couldn’t listen to any of the TV’s hdmi inputs (eg by pressing AV SAT). After trying to do so, I had to switch the system off and on again to control/hear normal TV.

[Madskp]

Got time for some more testing today before i began the repair on the MCL 2AV.

I think it has been mentioned before that my MCL2AV is a type 2020, but there is no sticker with the SW version. Only sticker I could find is on the Eprom.

Before I began my testing i made a reset of settings on the BC6 from the service menu as I was nervous that there could be unwanted settings made through the years that could affect the tests. For example both the analog and Digital TV tuner had been disabled.

MCL2AV stand alone option 1.5 and 2.5 + IR eye + PL speakers + BC3500 + iphone on CD input

I started with the MCL2AV in stand alone mode to confirm that things worked as expected. In both option settings 1.5 and 2.5 selection of both CD and tape input worked as expected with shift+radio+6/7 commands. And tape command was working when BC3500 was connected. When in option 1.5 AV + Video source command opens the Aux input. from all inputs music playing on speakers connected to the PL ports.

BC6 opt. 2 +1611 + MCL2AV opt 2.5 +IR eye + PL speakers + BC3500 + Iphone on CD input. All in same room

IR eye on MCL2AV will not react at all to IR commands even when blocking the IR on BC6. It seems like it’s disabled, so all IR is through the BC6

Mute button on IR eye has no function (but LED turns on and off), no long press standby

Full control of BC3500 with tape commands.

Cd input starts up with shift + Radio + 7 without problem

AV + Video Source just changes to that video source on the TV. No sound on MCL2AV PL speakers. In fact all the time in this scenario only very faint sound would come out of the PL speaker output on MCL2AV event when turning the volume up on the conencted computer speakers.

 

BC6 opt. 2 +1611 + MCL2AV opt 1.5 +IR eye + PL speakers + BC3500 + Iphone on CD input. All in same room but should be in 2 rooms in a real case scenario

Ir eye i functioning on the MCL2 AV, so had to block the IR sensor that I didn’t want tor receive the signals in this test.

Mute button on IR eye still has no function (but LED turns on and off) no long press standby, so I might have a defect somewhere.

Mute and volume control with remote works independently for

Full control of BC3500 from both MCL2AV and BC6, Start/stop and FF/RW affects both sources (stop in one room stop for all rooms etc.)

Cd input starts up independently on both sources with shift + Radio + 7

Sound is comming out of PL speaker output on MCL2AV

AV + Video Source command moves sound from BC6 video source to MCL2AV speakers, but not back when pressed once more. Can only go away with standby or choosing another source.

Short press standby when pointing at the BC6 IR sensor only turns off TV. For the MCL2AV a short press turns off MCL2 AV, but not TV. A long press pointing at the BC6 will turn off both devices.

 

So thats it for todays testing. I think the results are getting more stable, when you know what to expect, and I can see a use for both of the tested cases here either in the same room for the first one or i separate rooms for the second one.

 

 

[Madskp]

@Guy: One thing I don’t think you have tested is how the reaction to an AV + Video source command is from the BL3500 when connected to the 1611 and MCL2AV? Does it just open the video source on the 1611?

The reason for asking this is that I got an idea the the cable connected to the AUX port on the MCL2AV could be split up in an output (pin 1, 2, 4 and 6) to the 1611 and an extra input input (pin 2, 3, 5) which could be selected with the AV + video source command. I will also try to test this in my setup with the BC6 when I has some test time again

[Guy]

Madskp wrote:

I think it has been mentioned before that my MCL2AV is a type 2020, but there is no sticker with the SW version. Only sticker I could find is on the Eprom.

I just checked an my Type 2020 SW1.3 EPROM has the same lable. On my Type 2023 the label is formatted differently but has the same number up to …72, then is faded/illegible.

With regard to the rest of your testing, overall it looks pretty consistent with my results. The ‘two room setup (TV V.Opt 2, MCL L.Opt 1.5) does look most useful and it is re-assuring that datalink control of the BC3500 works so well. Also the power-off function is logical. (unlike when I used my Type 2023 MCL2AV).

Madskp wrote:

Mute button on IR eye still has no function (but LED turns on and off) no long press standby, so I might have a defect somewhere.

I have noticed strange physical mute button (and light) behaviour so I don’t think it’s a fault. I also had different behaviour between Type 2020 and Type 2023 so that confused me further. If I do further testing of MUTE and LED I will stick with the earlier Type 2020 to try to find results consistent with yours.

[Madskp]

Guy Wrote:

Madskp wrote:

@Guy: One thing I don’t think you have tested is how the reaction to an AV + Video source command is from the BL3500 when connected to the 1611 and MCL2AV? Does it just open the video source on the 1611?

Just tried that now (with no IR sensor on MCL2AV): BL3500 in Option 2 or 6: Behaves exactly as when selecting TV etc without AV first. Just opens the video source on the 1611. BL3500 in Option 1 or 5: You need to press AV first to open video source on the 1611. (Hence behaves just like most audiomasters in Opt 1) In both case above, if listening to video source, then pressing SHIFT RADO 6/7 or any audio source causes BL3500 to switch off.

Thanks for testing this. So the fifth audio input for the BL3500 is not an option. Might also have been overkill ?

 

[Madskp]

Guy wrote:

Madskp wrote:

Mute button on IR eye still has no function (but LED turns on and off) no long press standby, so I might have a defect somewhere.

I have noticed strange physical mute button (and light) behaviour so I don’t think it’s a fault. I also had different behaviour between Type 2020 and Type 2023 so that confused me further. If I do further testing of MUTE and LED I will stick with the earlier Type 2020 to try to find results consistent with yours.

Good to know that not nesecarily broken. For good meassure I will try to make a MCL cable and hook the MCL2AV up to my BM5500 to see if everything works as expected there.

just found a bag with MCL cable and speakerlink connectors in my storage today. Also in the bag was an extra IR eye of the same tape as used with the MCL2AV just wired up with a minijack from when I used it with a Beoport many years ago. Made me remember that it came from a MCL2AV I had over 20 years ago, but didn’t know how to use at that time, so it probably ended up as E waste ?

[Madskp]

matador wrote:

Guy wrote:

so how about a new thread title of ‘BeoLink Converter 1611 Innovative Configurations’?

Done now!

Great 🙂 Now we can really widen the scope of this thread 😉

Joke aside, one thing we haven’t discussed about the use of the 1611 in this thread is how it could be used with a Beosound with Masterlink. It would probably give an extra aux input with a video command. But could it also give an extra sound input, or will the Beosound just open it’s integrated aux input regardless of audio command that is not integrated for example N.music?

[Author]

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